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    • CommentAuthorWarA22
    • CommentTimeApr 18th 2006 edited
     permalink
    Hello everyone, this is my first post so I hope it's going into the right category.

    I'm going to be attempting to freelance and/or do part-time contract work for the next little while, so I've been updating my resume to reflect my work history. I also decided it might be a good idea to write a CV detailing a list of all the sites I've been able to work on.

    Where my actual questions lies is that, for the last 6 months, I worked full time doing contact work for a small company on a number of sites. I want to list all these sites I worked on in my resume and format a CV properly. I'm just concerned that since I did these as part of another company, not personal freelanced work, is this okay to document these sites? and if so, how do I make it clear that these aren't my specific clients (I don't want anyone from this company contacting me accusing me of making it look like I'm claiming their clients as my own.)

    For frame of reference, copies of how I've currently set up my resume and CV are here,
    http://infidel-regime.com/about/shawn-allison_resume_2006.pdf
    http://infidel-regime.com/about/shawn-allison_cv_2006.pdf

    Thanks in advance for any and all advice.
    • CommentAuthormaspick
    • CommentTimeApr 18th 2006
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    Shawn -

    You might want to get approval from your former employer to include their sites as examples of your work. You should especially avoid contacting their clients without the former employer's permission. Better to be safe than sorry.

    That's my 2 cents. :^{>
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      CommentAuthortsk
    • CommentTimeApr 19th 2006
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    I recently confrunted with a simmilar issue. I quit my job at a local webdesign firm, but I kept the websites listed on my portfolio (with the mention of the contracting firm). My former employer didn't aprove and went so far as to claiming that the websites were his own. Also he threatened me with a lawsuit for posting those websites on my personal portfolio.

    However through legal study I found that I am entitled to keep the websites on my portfolio as they are still intelectual property and I am not forced by anyone to place a reference to the contractor.

    It would be unethical to contact those clients but as I mentioned I am entitled to show that I was the designer of their websites (on my PERSONAL portfolio).

    I recommend that you check with your employer first and see what his terms are but also consult some legal notices on that issue.
    • CommentAuthorWarA22
    • CommentTimeApr 19th 2006 edited
     permalink
    Yes, I signed a contact with my employer on my resignation. Along with the obvious of not reusing/stealing content, images, etc, it also stipulated that I would not contact any of these clients on an independant basis (be it asking for additional work, letters of reference, etc.)

    Perhaps it would be better if I just made a more concise list of sites? Just URLs or perhaps just projects themselves? Or maybe even something as simple as "examples/lists of sites available upon request"? (I sure most people don't want to read a big long list anyhow.)
    • CommentAuthorDunk Ra
    • CommentTimeApr 20th 2006
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    @tsk - are you referring to US law?

    @WarA22 - Having "examples/lists of sites available upon request" is not going to get you much work IMHO.

    If I'm recruiting a freelancer and I have 10 CV's and only, say, 2 have URL's of live projects, I'd know who'd I'd be contacting first.

    ----------------

    I have a similar dilemma. I want to link to live sites I've designed and coded but the problem is that they are all CMS driven and often the client makes a few 'tweaks' and presents content in an inconsistent way. This obviously brings the overall quality of the site down and can break accessibility rules.

    I could put up mockups in my portfolio but nothing beats URLs. I thought about adding some kind of disclaimer to appear for all live URL's but am finding it hard to write 'Please note: this site was perfect when I handed it over but the client may have messed it up a bit since then'.

    Obviously the client will see incoming traffic to their website from my portfolio site and may not be too impressed by any such disclaimer!

    Any suggestions?
    • CommentAuthorWarA22
    • CommentTimeApr 20th 2006
     permalink
    "If I'm recruiting a freelancer and I have 10 CV's and only, say, 2 have URL's of live projects, I'd know who'd I'd be contacting first."

    Extremely good point.

    I think what I'm honestly going to do is just leave things as they are for now. I feel I've made it fairly clear that I worked on these sites but it was under contract for a specific webdesign company, which to me makes it clear these aren't my clients.

    If anyone from said company gets in contact with me with complaints about this, I will simply find an amicable solution that suits both sides.
    •  
      CommentAuthortsk
    • CommentTimeApr 20th 2006 edited
     permalink
    @Dunk Ra - no, I don't live in the US so I don't go by US legislation. I live in Romania, a country where the law on copyright is still under development in order to align it to EU standards.

    @WarA22 - as Dunk Ra specified, practical examples of your WORK (not clients) is a decissive issue when going to present a CV to a future employer and/or client. They'll want to see something you've done to have a point of reference on your skills.

    Do try to have a talk with your former employer and explain why you want to include those websites on your CV and make it clear that this doesn't mean you assume the client as your own. If needed or specified you can include a line on your CV like: "website developed while working at [COMPANY NAME HERE] ".

    In my opinion that would be a fair reference exchange.
    • CommentAuthorDunk Ra
    • CommentTimeApr 21st 2006
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    @tsk - thanks for letting me know, I would like to find out more on the details of 'intelectual property'. I've just completed a website for a government agency that is one of 22 throughout England and at the lauch of the site there was much interest from the other 21 members in the web design. Our client didn't want to let them use the same design on their own sites as they had funded it and were happy with their unique website.


    @WarA22 - By chance I was just browsing the Cuban Council's portfolio and some of their work appears to be sub-contracted. As you both suggest they simply add statements such as:



    "The design was developed with Odopod who also did the flash implementation."


    "Another job sub-contracting for Ignited Minds."


    "We worked with Odopod on redesigning Target's ambitious new gaming portal ..."




    Any ideas or help with my disclaimer copy mentioned above are most welcome.

    •  
      CommentAuthortsk
    • CommentTimeApr 22nd 2006
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    Dunk Ra, what I understand through intelectual property is that I am the original author of the specific work/website and that no one can deny that. Even if copyrights have been granted or sold, this right allows you to state that it is your work.

    Just take a look at any portfolio and you'll see links to works. When you get there you may not see the design agency's link or "design by" but only the company's copyright. However it is unethical to say that the company has built their website and deny any aknowledgement of the design agency's involvment.

    As far as I know that's how intelectual property works.
    If you have sold copyrights to the company you designed the website for it is their matter to deal with others and they are the ones to decide if they'll give out their design. As far as you are concerned you are not allowed to use the SAME design on other works. Firstly because you'd compromise the client's identity on the web and second you may want to keep your portfolio fresh on designs and not go through the same one over and over again.

    You said that it is a government agency out of 22. I don't know under which terms the website was handed over but I do consider that it is their call to decide wether they are going to allow their design to be reused.

    If the website was given to a superior authority like a ministry that governs the 22 agencies than it would have been logical that it would agree to unite them under one website or design.
    • CommentAuthorDunk Ra
    • CommentTimeApr 24th 2006
     permalink
    Thanks for explaining that so simply tsk.

    Yes, I'd love to unite the 22 agencies under one design, it's an obvious thing to do but sometimes government organisations don't always choose the most logical route!
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